Transgender athletes back on the agenda

[think positive]

That’s the impression I get.

Certainly you don’t care about genuine female athletes who have put the work, sweat, tears and guts into their sport, for however many years, since you think it’s acceptable for them to be shoved off the podium by someone who may well identify as a female, believe 100% that they were born in the wrong body, but still they will always always have the wrong body no matter how many drugs or how much surgery they have.

No one on earth gets everything they desire, no one, not even the queen, God, Trump, no one, Why should transgenders get to? Which ever way you look at it, they potentially have an enormous advantage, and yes I know, certain woman naturally do, lucky them, but it’s not genetically modified.

And don’t give me the but I’m a 10 lb weekling thing, you could be a jockey, I couldn’t!

So now accusation of not accepting them as ‘real’ woman, I admit, I don’t. I have no issue with anyone living how they want, how they feel they need to, but there will always be barriers, and some of them should stay in place.

Andan asterisk will always be next to their names, even if it’s invisible likethe ones next to the Chinese swimmers wins!

[David]

That's a saddening opinion. Do you notice that you've created a dichotomy between so-called "genuine" female athletes who put years of hard work into their sport and the transgender athletes who simply turn up and "shove them off the podium"? Whether or not they are blessed with physical advantages, don't you think that trans athletes train just as hard for their success, and deserve better than to be treated as frauds stealing medals away from "real" women?

As for nobody getting everything they want, again, it's not as if these people are just turning up and asking for a medal. They want to compete honestly, do the best they can and succeed at what they love doing, just like any other female athlete. I think there has to be a very good reason for them to be turned away from doing so, and generalisations about male and female bodies aren't enough. If there has to be discrimination, at least shape it in terms of acceptable testosterone levels and body weight, not just a blanket ban.

[stui magpie]

Would it seriously be such a large sacrifice if you said to a transgender female that they were legally female and recognised as such for all purposes with one exception, they are not allowed to compete at the top level in female sport due to inherent biological advantages?

The vast majority of top level athletes are finished their career by their early 30's. They could still indulge their competitive instincts at a local more social level.

[think positive]

That's a saddening opinion. Do you notice that you've created a dichotomy between so-called "genuine" female athletes who put years of hard work into their sport and the transgender athletes who simply turn up and "shove them off the podium"? Whether or not they are blessed with physical advantages, don't you think that trans athletes train just as hard for their success, and deserve better than to be treated as frauds stealing medals away from "real" women?

As for nobody getting everything they want, again, it's not as if these people are just turning up and asking for a medal. They want to compete honestly, do the best they can and succeed at what they love doing, just like any other female athlete. I think there has to be a very good reason for them to be turned away from doing so, and generalisations about male and female bodies aren't enough. If there has to be discrimination, at least shape it in terms of acceptable testosterone levels and body weight, not just a blanket ban.

Your not going to make me feel guilty or bad about my opinion, if they want to compete at the top level they can start a transgender league. There is a good reason, they were born with a male body and regardless of what they do to it they will die with a male body.

I agree totally with with Stu in his post, and I’ll add if they want to compete st the highest level do it before you transition

I honestly can’t believe any of the transgenders that have won anything after they transition really think they deserve it, make if it what you will but there is a reason women’s tennis is three sets not 5.

[David]

^ And if they've had reassignment surgery? Or is "a male body" just whatever you choose to define it as?

[Wokko]

^ And if they've had reassignment surgery? Or is "a male body" just whatever you choose to define it as?

Cosmetic surgery doesn't change your biological sex. They still need to be screened for prostate cancer, they'll be identified as male if their remains are ever dug up. Mutilation and hormone manipulation doesn't make someone a woman.

I have no issue with anyone of sound mind making these decisions about their own body, they can mess it up as much as they want and I wouldn't be rude or mean to someone because of these decisions, but the suicide rates of post ops and the huge number of cases of regret and wanting reversals makes me wonder how many transgender people are of sane mind and how many are suffering from mental illness that needs treatment, not indulging. If they thought they were a cat, or Napoleon or a hat stand then they would be treated for delusions, there is zero reason why gender dysphoria should be treated differently.

[stui magpie]

^ And if they've had reassignment surgery? Or is "a male body" just whatever you choose to define it as?

Gender is a social construct but biology isn't.

Lines is sport have been drawn down the binary lines of Sex, not gender to ensure women don't compete against men.

For mine there's too many variables to deal with hence I suggest the blanket ban on top level sport.

Having full reassignment surgery as a 25 year old who had already competed at the elite level as a male for example isn't going to undo the years of training or the physiological advantage.

Neither does taking hormones to lower testosterone for someone who may not have competed at the highest level as a male but had a good level of natural ability and years of training .

Shit, if I transitioned at my age (and had 2 knee reconstructions), got a level of fitness up, I could play AFLW as a ruck

You cannot change biology and physiology with a social construct. You can change the social perception, how you're treated and acknowledged. A Male who transitions to a Female should be able to be acknowledged and recognised as female for all purposes, except participation in elite sport.

[Skids]

^ And if they've had reassignment surgery? Or is "a male body" just whatever you choose to define it as?

Cosmetic surgery doesn't change your biological sex. They still need to be screened for prostate cancer, they'll be identified as male if their remains are ever dug up. Mutilation and hormone manipulation doesn't make someone a woman.

I have no issue with anyone of sound mind making these decisions about their own body, they can mess it up as much as they want and I wouldn't be rude or mean to someone because of these decisions, but the suicide rates of post ops and the huge number of cases of regret and wanting reversals makes me wonder how many transgender people are of sane mind and how many are suffering from mental illness that needs treatment, not indulging. If they thought they were a cat, or Napoleon or a hat stand then they would be treated for delusions, there is zero reason why gender dysphoria should be treated differently.

Stop it.... common sense will not be tolerated in the world today. You should know better.

[think positive]

What these three said!

[David]

[think positive]

When your talking about millions and zillions of competing athletes, you don’t make a rule for the odd one or two.

The fact remains they were born with a body, be it male or female, and that’s what biologically they will die with.

What shits me here is you going on about it, makes us all sound cold and heartless, but we are not, you just don’t want to get our point of view. No one is unsympathetic to the situation, not that I can see, everyone has been respectful, but facts are facts, you can’t change biology to the extent where a dug up body will reap different results from when it was born. I actually saw this on a CSI program, they made comments about signs of gender reassignment surgery!

[David]

The only people making you seem cold and heartless are yourselves. Own it. Or else rethink your desire to stop people from doing what they love in service of some abstract principle.

[think positive]

The only people making you seem cold and heartless are yourselves. Own it. Or else rethink your desire to stop people from doing what they love in service of some abstract principle.

The sex you are born with is not an abstract principle it’s a cold hard fact. I’m not against anyone doing anything their heart desires unless it breaks the law, or they have an unfair advantage that is not just a normal variation to their gender, you cannot change your biology. If they feel the need to compete as an athlete then do it before they transition, simple.

I’ve said it before it must be awful to feel you were born in the wrong body , actually I doknow, I’m sure I was meant to be naturally 55kg with legs to my armpits and a tumbling mane of hair, able to leap tall buildings while still looking like an Amazon queen, sadly that ain’t what I got. Guess I’ll live with it hey? Yes a ridiculous comparison but quite frankly I find the whole thing ridiculous.

Being a world champion is not a right. They can live without it, or compete fairly. Otherwise go essendrug and the Chinese swimmers.

[stui magpie]

[stui magpie]