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Posted: Thu Aug 06, 2015 2:26 pm
by RudeBoy
think positive wrote:SwansWay wrote:That article doesn't really say anything. They detected high levels of TB4 in 2 players with the hopes of making a case against the other 32 which is pretty circumstantial. The fact that the body naturally produces it could mean that those 2 players just happened to have organically high levels. Once again, this proves nothing. They don't have much of a case if this is what they're going with.
I like the Bombers and would be happy if this whole mess could be over. Players only get a short window for an AFL career so it saddens me that maybe 3 or 4 years of a 10 year a career (often much less) will be squandered in limbo.
I don't know why people are so excited to see them get burned. Nobody really knows what took place and it's becoming a bigger farce than it already was in the first place. Either bust them or drop the case. My God, this is really bad for the game to protract this into next season.
and whos fault is that? because they destroyed evidence its dragged on. you dont destroy evidence if you have nothing to hide. they tried to cheat. it doesnt matter if it doesnt work. its still cheating. if they dont serve time, then it may as well be a free for all. id like it over too, 3 years ago when the whole mess started. but they just keep dodging and changing the story.
I feel sorry for the players, who were the innocent victims in all this. But Hird needs to be kicked out of the game for life.
Posted: Thu Aug 06, 2015 2:40 pm
by think positive
no they were not innocent victims.
it might not be easy to say no, but they still should have done it. the old timers who had been in the game a while, why didnt they question the sudden change re getting jabbed with needles, not just one needle, dozens of them, why did they sign a consent form? why didnt they question why that was necessary, why didnt one player go home and say, hey i reckon this is a bit suss. what did Jobes old man say?
mark thompson said he had reservations about it, so did the doc, you cant tell me not one player didnt have doubts,
the cops dont let you off for speeding because the limit used to be 10klm an hour less, ignorance is no defence.
the drug shit is drummed into them over and over. they knew. its just more lies.
i maybe have a bit of sympathy for the 1st year kids, but thats it
Posted: Thu Aug 06, 2015 2:47 pm
by Member 7167
swoop42 wrote:How in the hell could ASADA not ask for tb4 to be tested originally?
Because there was no approved test at the time for TB4. There is now.
Posted: Thu Aug 06, 2015 2:48 pm
by RudeBoy
I'm sure the players had doubts and concerns, but I'm equally sure they felt under pressure to do what was asked of them by Hird. That's how footy clubs operate - it's one in all in. They would have trusted their club, just as Collingwood players would have done the same thing if Bucks had run a similar program at Collingwood.
Posted: Thu Aug 06, 2015 3:02 pm
by think positive
and id say the same thing, sack them all
Posted: Thu Aug 06, 2015 3:24 pm
by Member 7167
think positive wrote:and id say the same thing, sack them all
A bit harsh TP. Young men make mistakes. They should do their time and be given further opportunity if appropriate. To an extent they had trust in the club and that reinforced by peer pressure would have made it quite difficult for individuals to opt out.
The fact is that if the club gives you assurances and are not truthful about the drugs they are being given, significant responsibility needs to be directed to the club and the clubs management and leaders. For all we know they guys might have thought they were getting vitamins to boost their immune system and aide their recovery. I'm sure there was some deception on behalf of the EFC.
Posted: Thu Aug 06, 2015 3:59 pm
by Cuthbert Collingwood
As far as I'm aware, especially with the way that the Lance Armstrong case was prosecuted, this sort of evidence, combined with the huge amounts of that particular peptide purchased by the club, may well be enough to prove the case against the entirety. Don't forget, it wasn't the only illegal peptide they were taking and there was a hell of a lot of circumstantial evidence that was only dismissed by the AFL tribunal because of the shredding fest that went on down at Windy Hill. I believe that WADA's approach is more of a "we don't care what you destroyed, we'll still get you" approach.
Posted: Thu Aug 06, 2015 4:34 pm
by neil
Let them off? **** off if 13 year old female Chinese swimmers are called drug cheats then a bunch of professional sportsmen who have managers, an AFLPA, access to the internet, training in drug awareness, access to medical advice, a drug hotline provided by the AFL and other goodies are total and complete cheats.
Posted: Thu Aug 06, 2015 4:40 pm
by Lazza
Posted: Thu Aug 06, 2015 5:03 pm
by Cuthbert Collingwood
neil wrote:Let them off? **** off if 13 year old female Chinese swimmers are called drug cheats then a bunch of professional sportsmen who have managers, an AFLPA, access to the internet, training in drug awareness, access to medical advice, a drug hotline provided by the AFL and other goodies are total and complete cheats.
Neil, you have to be intelligent enough to use the internet. I'm sure a 13 year old female Chinese swimmer is smarter than the entire EFC list combined
Posted: Thu Aug 06, 2015 5:24 pm
by Cuthbert Collingwood
http://theage.com.au/afl/essendon-playe ... it1ym.html
Apparently it's "unfair on the players" according to the Dons. Tell that to Keeffe and JT who weren't even deliberately taking PED's. They'll cop their year or two in good grace I'm sure. Ffs, why is it so different for Essendon and why do they have to get such special treatment? Systematic doping? Collusion across all levels of the club? Thousands and thousands of injections? Diddums phaarking diddums
Posted: Thu Aug 06, 2015 6:37 pm
by neil
Posted: Thu Aug 06, 2015 7:14 pm
by stui magpie
Cuthbert Collingwood wrote:http://theage.com.au/afl/essendon-players-frustrated-by-leaks-dons-boss-says-20150806-git1ym.html
Apparently it's "unfair on the players" according to the Dons. Tell that to Keeffe and JT who weren't even deliberately taking PED's. They'll cop their year or two in good grace I'm sure. Ffs, why is it so different for Essendon and why do they have to get such special treatment? Systematic doping? Collusion across all levels of the club? Thousands and thousands of injections? Diddums phaarking diddums
That's actually an excellent point.
By all accounts Keeffe and Thomas didn't intend to take performance enhancing drugs at all, they intended to take "party" drugs for which the first offence is a slap over the wrist now they face a two year ban for something unintentional.
The Essendon players DID intend to take performance enhancing drugs, they just were told that they were legal. They trusted the club to do the right thing by them, which I suppose is at least smarter than trusting a drug dealer to do the right thing by you, so they do have that bit going for them.
If the players are found guilty, suspend the club for 2 years.
Posted: Thu Aug 06, 2015 7:17 pm
by HAL
OK I will tell them when I see 'em.
Posted: Thu Aug 06, 2015 7:18 pm
by AN_Inkling
^^The Essendon players though would have had more opportunity to test the claims made by their club. In my view Keeffe and Thomas are less culpable than the Essendon players.