Our veteran quandary

[lazzadesilva]

I think its time to start managing a few players out, in terms of giving younger players like Allen and McInnes a start...the oldies should be played sporadically, and may well have something to offer come September.

But isn’t that going to multiply the “Noble” situation by dropping younger players who play good football to avoid being relegated and being replaced by managed players who played only sporadically? I’m not sure how that works.

[Piesnchess]

I would say, that at seasons end, regardless of where we finish, it will be farewell to some great servants of our Club , I can see Howe, Cox, Checkers retiring, maybe even Pendles, who is the type of guy who wont struggle on just to get too 400, he has too much dignity for that, been a magnificent player, certainly a top 3 all time Magpie champion in my book. Yes, we do need to start blooding kids soon, give some older players managed, a break now.

[Pies4shaw]

It's the middle of March - you don't want your established stars going at more than half rat-power, at this stage. The ones I worry about are the younger players who are supposed to be "pushing up" - where the f%^& are they when they are required?

[stui magpie]

Fin has pretty much kicked the door down with his performances in the VFL, the same can't be said for many of the others.
Checkers needs help up forward, his body takes a battering each week. We have to play Reef.
Cox, Pendles and Sidey can easy play another 2-3 seasons if required but Howe has to be just 1 more injury from retiring.

As the season goes on we will need to manage some of the older players by resting them which creates opportunity for the younger guys. Either the young ones play well enough to keep the old guys out, like in 2010, or they don't which means they can't argue when they go back to the VFL, but if we have guys in the VFL demanding inclusion through form, we have to reward that.

[Johnno75]

The MacCrae decision as sub seemed bizarre given we dropped Mitchell and had Hill, McCreery, Elliott and Schultz in the 22. I felt Elliott should have been sub. MacCrae must start playing full games over the next few weeks so he can start establishing himself as an inside mid.

[stui magpie]

^Bring in Reef for Ash next week, start Fin, and make Elliot the sub in case Reef doesn't touch it.

[lazzadesilva]

It's the middle of March - you don't want your established stars going at more than half rat-power, at this stage. The ones I worry about are the younger players who are supposed to be "pushing up" - where the f%^& are they when they are required?

Doesn’t make sense to go half rat power and lose when the experienced players are the ones who should be responsible for teaching the youngsters how to win games. The young players also don’t have a magic portion to drink and immediately become major stars. It all takes time as we all know.

[Gerry Cooper]

I dont know what some of the posters in this thread are on but I want some of it now!

Both Pendles and Sidebottom are just about cooked. Pendles last year was getting caught with the ball a lot and judging on two games, that is only worse again. Sidebottom, old champ that he is, got a fair amount of the ball but coughed it up in contests, gave away frees at important times and did little with the possessions he did get. He looked slow and off the pace all game. Neither should be going on at the end of this season, let alone two or three more. However both may improve when the grounds get softer but at the moment both are way off it. Maybe manage them now and restart them in May.

Jamie Elliot looked cooked last finals series and apart from standing up with considerable pride at the end of last night's game, has done little. Like Mihocek he needs another younger tall forward down there crashing packs and drawing attention from Elliot who is at best the third marking forward option these days. Also his kicking has dropped off and he barely makes 40 metres with his goal shooting now.

Crisp seems strangely out of sorts and couldn't keep up with the pace of the game. Having him playing off half back didn't seem the best way to use his talents I thought.

We need a plan to phase the two old champs out gracefully but should accept that both of them are just about done.

[warburton lad]

The Veteran Quandary.....

Three games ago, the veterans produced in spades.
However, as the old saying goes "Time and tide wait for no man.."
I would bring in Ed Allan and play him on the wing.
Sidebottom forward where he could use his footy smarts to be a creator (and kicker) of goals.
Certainly Reef McInnes comes in for Johnson.
If the club were really brave, they could play Oscar Steene and rest Cox.
Steene would make a very big, mobile marking forward option for the next few weeks. McStay is sorely missed.
The Murphy concussion stuff has dislocated the cohesion of the back half.
Ironically, with all this talk of veterans, Taylor Adams would have been useful these past two games. I cannot believe that he would not have laid the crunching tackles to inspire the team.
At year's end, we may be farewelling Howe, Cox and Sidebottom- however, if we are to be there when the whips are cracking, perhaps their experience is still required on the field.
There will be a fair bit of heat applied to the list managers if Ginnivan continues to shine at Hawthorn- I still agree with the call by the way.
Schultz will be a very good asset.
2024 may well be a year where we see the emergence of Allan, Steene, McInnes, Macrae, Harrison, Jath and De Mattea. They may come in and be the fresh blood we need to reach the summit in the years to come.

Forest Pics

[Ronnie McKeowns boots]

I think its time to start managing a few players out, in terms of giving younger players like Allen and McInnes a start...the oldies should be played sporadically, and may well have something to offer come September.

But isn’t that going to multiply the “Noble” situation by dropping younger players who play good football to avoid being relegated and being replaced by managed players who played only sporadically? I’m not sure how that works.

Well, the 'Noble situation' ended with a flag...no one is gifted a spot if there is a better replacement

[Ronnie McKeowns boots]

^

Bring in Reef for Ash next week, start Fin, and make Elliot the sub in case Reef doesn't touch it.

I think playing Elliott as sub is a good idea; his class and nous means he can play almost anywhere but back, and when the sting goes out of thew game he can have a bigger impact.

[MatthewBoydFanClub]

Look at it this way. Charlie Dean in his first couple of games has shown us to be a nervous player who has the skills but is being outmuscled by his opponents. Now project into his future after he has played another 30-50 games. Hopefully we have a key tall forward with the potential to play for the next 5 years. Now do the same for Elliot, Howe and Pendlebury, comparing them now to what they were last year and the year before. Pendlebury and Elliot used to be elusive and it was rare that a tackle ever held and it was rare that a ball that ever left their foot didn't reach a team mate or went for a goal. It's different now. They will still run up the stat sheet and kick the occasional goal, but is that what we want? Do we want to nurse Pendlebury to his 400th game or do we want to win another premiership? It's basically time to make decisions on some of our veteran's futures if we're going to get games into the players who are going to form the future premiership team. Otherwise the team just staggers along and beats the lower down teams, but I can't imagine we're going to win against GWS again this year. Geelong has the same problem as us, but whereas they drip feed their younger players into the team, we can't even play a player like Macrae who's been knocking down the door in the preseason.

[David]

I dont know what some of the posters in this thread are on but I want some of it now!

Both Pendles and Sidebottom are just about cooked. Pendles last year was getting caught with the ball a lot and judging on two games, that is only worse again. Sidebottom, old champ that he is, got a fair amount of the ball but coughed it up in contests, gave away frees at important times and did little with the possessions he did get. He looked slow and off the pace all game. Neither should be going on at the end of this season, let alone two or three more. However both may improve when the grounds get softer but at the moment both are way off it. Maybe manage them now and restart them in May.

Jamie Elliot looked cooked last finals series and apart from standing up with considerable pride at the end of last night's game, has done little. Like Mihocek he needs another younger tall forward down there crashing packs and drawing attention from Elliot who is at best the third marking forward option these days. Also his kicking has dropped off and he barely makes 40 metres with his goal shooting now.

Crisp seems strangely out of sorts and couldn't keep up with the pace of the game. Having him playing off half back didn't seem the best way to use his talents I thought.

We need a plan to phase the two old champs out gracefully but should accept that both of them are just about done.

I'm kind of relieved to read this, because I saw the exact same thing with Pendlebury last year and wasn't sure if I was insane or just had no idea what I was talking about, given all the talk about him being able to play on for another 3 to 4 years. But it's just seemed obvious to me in both games so far this season that he was struggling to impact.

[Mr Miyagi]

It’s not just our over 30s who looked way off the pace. Apart from Nick Daicos, no one can looked on. There were many moments Sidey had the ball but was surrounded by opposition and no ting bucks seen anywhere near him.

[Charlie Oneeye]

Before we are too reactive.. Brisbane looks like it's going to lose its 2nd game too. Something to ponder.

Ageing players not listed here are contracted beyond 2024.
36 Scott Pendlebury
33 Jeremy Howe
33 Steele Sidebottom
30 Will Hoskin-Elliott

I expect Pendles retires. Howe and Sidey are still contributing.. I think Howe will retire, Sidey still will be here in 2025 IMO.
I think WHE will be signing and he will be satisfied being on the fringe of selection.

Retirees
36 Scott Pendlebury
33 Jeremy Howe

Signing on for 2025
33 Steele Sidebottom
30 Will Hoskin-Elliott


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