Transgender athletes back on the agenda

[Durka]

In other words, sounds like you have no idea what you’re talking about.

Well argued response. Very insightful.
Sounds like your ideology is what you are talking about.
In other words, if it walks like a duck, looks like a duck and quacks like a duck, it is a rhinoceros.

[David]

"There is a problem with her hormones, with her chromosomes, but she is a woman."

In other words, the bloke has XY chromosomes and high testosterone, but has taken some suppressants, and therefore became a woman.

Reminds me of the Seinfeld episode where George said "It's not a lie if you believe it".

Fits in perfectly with the "my truth" comments that has worked its way into common usage.

Certainly sounds like a genetic hiccup at birth, and the assigned female comment makes sense. A horrible thing to hapoen, for sure, wouldn’t wish it on my worst enemy, but the rules should still apply.

Being intersex, if indeed Khelif is, doesn't have to be a "horrible thing to happen" or something you "wouldn't wish on your worst enemy", though, so long as society is set up to accommodate these differences. Take exclusion, prejudice and unnecessary medical interventions out of the picture – that is, all things that are structurally within our control – and intersex people's lives will be far less of a struggle than they have been in the past. And we can celebrate rather than condemn their achievements, in sport and other endeavours.

[stui magpie]

The Gender assigned at birth is purely a matter of whether the baby has indoor or outdoor plumbing. They don't run batteries of tests.

So Khelif was, for all intents and purposes born female, raised female and identifies as female.

The same or similar condition potentially occurs with lots of people who never find out unless abnormalities present post puberty, they have difficulty getting pregnant or they want to play elite sport where they will be tested for performance enhancing drugs, of which Testonsterone is one.

I genuinely feel sorry for her but that doesn't mean I believe her, or others, should be able to compete at elite sport against women, I don't believe it's fair to the majority. If a woman has a condition that means her body naturally produces male levels of testosterone, she has the same if not a larger competitive advantage than a drug cheat has, even though it's not their fault. She certainly shouldn't be demonised for her condition but should not be able to compete in womens elite sport unless that advantage can be shown clearly to have been neutralised.

[think positive]

The Gender assigned at birth is purely a matter of whether the baby has indoor or outdoor plumbing. They don't run batteries of tests.

So Khelif was, for all intents and purposes born female, raised female and identifies as female.

The same or similar condition potentially occurs with lots of people who never find out unless abnormalities present post puberty, they have difficulty getting pregnant or they want to play elite sport where they will be tested for performance enhancing drugs, of which Testonsterone is one.

I genuinely feel sorry for her but that doesn't mean I believe her, or others, should be able to compete at elite sport against women, I don't believe it's fair to the majority. If a woman has a condition that means her body naturally produces male levels of testosterone, she has the same if not a larger competitive advantage than a drug cheat has, even though it's not their fault. She certainly shouldn't be demonised for her condition but should not be able to compete in womens elite sport unless that advantage can be shown clearly to have been neutralised.

This exactly.

Andthe problem is this bullshi5 woke world means no tests, take the word of her passport!

On gender assignment, usually it’s obvious, but as I said earlier, when a whoopsie happens gender can be assigned, for me born female and assigned female are 2 very different things.


The world shouldn’t be in an uproar about this, because quite simply, both ofthe athletes involved should have had to undergo specific testing for the Olympics. I doubt either would pass, and X-Y should be an immediate fail.

[think positive]

"There is a problem with her hormones, with her chromosomes, but she is a woman."

In other words, the bloke has XY chromosomes and high testosterone, but has taken some suppressants, and therefore became a woman.

Reminds me of the Seinfeld episode where George said "It's not a lie if you believe it".

Fits in perfectly with the "my truth" comments that has worked its way into common usage.

Certainly sounds like a genetic hiccup at birth, and the assigned female comment makes sense. A horrible thing to hapoen, for sure, wouldn’t wish it on my worst enemy, but the rules should still apply.

Being intersex, if indeed Khelif is, doesn't have to be a "horrible thing to happen" or something you "wouldn't wish on your worst enemy", though, so long as society is set up to accommodate these differences. Take exclusion, prejudice and unnecessary medical interventions out of the picture – that is, all things that are structurally within our control – and intersex people's lives will be far less of a struggle than they have been in the past. And we can celebrate rather than condemn their achievements, in sport and other endeavours.

Ihave never had a problem with that, but to compete they need an applicable category, and the same standards should apply. No different from doping.