Post Match. Swans smash Pies. All comments, please.

[Ronnie McKeowns boots]

Well the evidence from the previous crop is in, and we have very few players on the list who have been developed under Buckley, very few indeed

[Haff]

Don’t want to start a new thread but I came to a realisation today. Buckley has, amongst many other things, cost Pendles a brownlow. How many times has Pendles been in the perfect position, takes a mark and then.... holds up the ball or kicks sideways? Why? He’s coached that way and there is no structure up the field because our game plan is so deficient it’s like Buckley hates scoring. You never saw Ablett do that, sure he got lots of possessions out the back but he was just so damaging like all the best players. If Pendles had a competent coach for the last 10 years, He would be in the absolute upper echelon of players. Now? Sure he’s always in the conversation in the best players in the game but not mentioned with the top midfields of all time. Putting that squarely on the square jaw of Buckley. Our kids have no chance.

[Magpietothemax]

It's easy to "play the kids", but are they being taught and coached properly?

The answer to that question will take a couple of seasons to become obvious.

no, that is just evasion. The answer to that question is obvious now, we dont have to wait for 2 years to see it.
I think Adam Treloar is a perfect metaphor for the impact of Bux on the development of our players. Adz was Bux' darling when he came to the club. Throughout his time with us, he was played in the wrong position, but gave everything and often produced brilliance despite not being utilised in the right way by the coach. Finally, when the salary cap catastrophe burst into the open, the coach turned on his darling viciously and spread lies about him in order to force him out.
Now that Adz is being played where he should be played, and is free from the influence of Bux, he is an elite AFL player.
That is a harsh, but clear example, of why it is imperative for us to remove him as soon as possible. The end of the year is too long, in my view.

[The_Staunton]

That's what keeps me up at night. The best thing for these kids' development is getting Buckley and his cronies as far away from them as possible. And as soon as possible.

Exactly.
If we don't remove Bux and his mates asap they will destroy our young players as well.
I agree with the poster who commented that Keane looks like he could be a player, but not while he is strangled by Bux's suffocating and superdefensive structures.
I liked the way Tom Wilson moved and went crashing in, but I fear for his development as well while Bux is the coach.
Many are saying: "At least Bux is playing the kids". But I am very worried while Bux is the one coaching these kids.
I agree with you Jezza on another comment you made. It is just mindboggling, and extremely disappointing, that we are so reluctant to get rid of a coach who clearly cannot cut it.

Again pure speculation from a biased viewpoint.!! You don't KNOW this! Nor will you know whether the coach next season is developing the young ones properly. Why? Because the evidence takes TIME to be delivered.

Another 10 years then will help you make up your mind? How much time you want to give him!

Oh my lord.....

[Magpietothemax]

Well the evidence from the previous crop is in, and we have very few players on the list who have been developed under Buckley, very few indeed

Exactly. How can it possibly be suggested that we have to wait 2 years to see whether our current crop of young players is being coached properly??

[stui magpie]

OK, I get it, most here blame Bucks. That's fair enough. We'll just have to agree to disagree. I simply think we don't have enough good players.

Exactly right and all under whose watch? I mean how many decades do you give a guy to rebuild a premiership winning list RB?

Well it took Sydney (south melbourne) 72 years

[Lazza]

Good to see how much a loss hurts them as they laugh and joke after the game

Inspiring stuff

Setting that aside, worst Collingwood team I've seen in my life....

It's hopeless right now, absolutely hopeless

This comment got me thinking. I started barracking for the pies in 1969. I remember that 1976 being an awful year “winning” the wooden spoon for the first time in our history under Murray Weiderman. Then it happened under Tony Shaw a few years later in 1999. I reckon they were pretty bad teams. In 1976, they had the most wins ever (6) for a team winning the spoon. So the Tony Shaw team I reckon was the worst one I have seen.

[Magpietothemax]

OK, I get it, most here blame Bucks. That's fair enough. We'll just have to agree to disagree. I simply think we don't have enough good players.

Exactly right and all under whose watch? I mean how many decades do you give a guy to rebuild a premiership winning list RB?

Well it took Sydney (south melbourne) 72 years

At least they did change coaches over that time frame.

[The_Staunton]

Exactly right and all under whose watch? I mean how many decades do you give a guy to rebuild a premiership winning list RB?

Well it took Sydney (south melbourne) 72 years

At least they did change coaches over that time frame.

There are people on this board who would need 72 years to be REALLY sure Buckley can't coach

And even then.....

[Haff]

Well it took Sydney (south melbourne) 72 years

At least they did change coaches over that time frame.

There are people on this board who would need 72 years to be REALLY sure Buckley can't coach

And even then.....

Does my head in. You come into a new job as a manager. Realise quickly that you need more talent to achieve your goals. You put a plan together, work with the recruiting team to bring in talent that complements your goal. Said talent doesn’t deliver you the goal. That’s on you, your plan and your method. Why do people not get this?

[PyreneesPie]

It's easy to "play the kids", but are they being taught and coached properly?

The answer to that question will take a couple of seasons to become obvious.

no, that is just evasion. The answer to that question is obvious now, we dont have to wait for 2 years to see it.
I think Adam Treloar is a perfect metaphor for the impact of Bux on the development of our players. Adz was Bux' darling when he came to the club. Throughout his time with us, he was played in the wrong position, but gave everything and often produced brilliance despite not being utilised in the right way by the coach. Finally, when the salary cap catastrophe burst into the open, the coach turned on his darling viciously and spread lies about him in order to force him out.
Now that Adz is being played where he should be played, and is free from the influence of Bux, he is an elite AFL player.
That is a harsh, but clear example, of why it is imperative for us to remove him as soon as possible. The end of the year is too long, in my view.

Ah, here we have the real underpinning of your views. You want retribution for your own disappointments, which may or may not be the best thing for the way forward.

[watt price tully]

^ Josh Thomas is not our worst player and did some good things today as he does most weeks. He’s pressure efforts are usually very good.

The Browns however are just not good enough it seems.

Our backline is missing Roughead, Howe and Murphy. Our team is missing those three as well as Adams and Elliott, (not to mention Treloar, Stephenson and Phillips)

Pendles and Sidebottom aren’t the players they were.

Grundy is not the player he showed potential to be and is simply ineffective these days. He lacks presence.

Slight cOrrection: For someone who’s been in the system for such a long time JT is far and away our worst player by a country mile - he can’t take a contested mark to save his life and is always a half second too late in support and defence. His attempts to tackle are humorous and entertaining at best. The Browns probably have the worst case of stage fright ever and look overawed every time they play...they just need to settle and trust in themselves more....but time is definitely running out

Murphy’s only just played a couple of games so we can’t really miss what we never really had.

Grundy is doing the same things he’s always done it’s just that other teams have figured him out and rendered those things useless - spends far too much time trying to be a midfielder instead of a ruckman.

For those of you calling for Buckley’s head (and I’m not overly a Bux defender) how good did we look in the opening 20 mins or so....surely not his fault certain players can’t mark, kick, tackle, run, or do anything effectual.

From the injuries we’ve had and the way Murphy has played we have definitely missed him irrespective of how many games he has played.

JT is not in the team and has never been in the team for his contested making: that’s ridiculous claim to make. You could argue he doesn’t do enough but contested marking: you’re barking up the wrong tree.

JT does bring pressure acts but needs to do more.

[Pies4shaw]

Good to see how much a loss hurts them as they laugh and joke after the game

Inspiring stuff

Setting that aside, worst Collingwood team I've seen in my life....

It's hopeless right now, absolutely hopeless

This comment got me thinking. I started barracking for the pies in 1969. I remember that 1976 being an awful year “winning” the wooden spoon for the first time in our history under Murray Weiderman. Then it happened under Tony Shaw a few years later. I reckon they were pretty bad teams. In 1976, they had the most wins ever (6) for a team winning the spoon. So the Tony Shaw team I reckon was the worst one I have seen.

The 1976 team wasn't a bad team. It was badly coached by another favourite son with no clue whatsoever.

The team included Thompson, Wayne and Max Richardson, Tuddy, Moore, Picken, Carman, Manassa, Cooper, Kink, Ireland, Ray Shaw, Twiggy Dunne, Wearmouth and McCormack. Virtually the same team (with the addition of Worthington from WA) kicked off with a victory and won most of its games the following year. It's a classic example of how a team can look hopeless under a spud of a coach and yet suddenly look like world-beaters under a competent one.

[Magpietothemax]

The answer to that question will take a couple of seasons to become obvious.

no, that is just evasion. The answer to that question is obvious now, we dont have to wait for 2 years to see it.
I think Adam Treloar is a perfect metaphor for the impact of Bux on the development of our players. Adz was Bux' darling when he came to the club. Throughout his time with us, he was played in the wrong position, but gave everything and often produced brilliance despite not being utilised in the right way by the coach. Finally, when the salary cap catastrophe burst into the open, the coach turned on his darling viciously and spread lies about him in order to force him out.
Now that Adz is being played where he should be played, and is free from the influence of Bux, he is an elite AFL player.
That is a harsh, but clear example, of why it is imperative for us to remove him as soon as possible. The end of the year is too long, in my view.

Ah, here we have the real underpinning of your views. You want retribution for your own disappointments, which may or may not be the best thing for the way forward.

I think you misunderstood the point I am making. The Treloar saga is illustrative of the kinds of rapport that we can expect Buckley establishes with the team. It is one very important facet of the incompetent nature of his coaching. Player relationships is one facet, upon which developing players is utterly dependent. But there are other facets as well: the ability to play players in the positions most suited to their talents is another, ability to harness players' full potential with an effective game plan is another, ability to make effective tactical changes during games is another. On all these counts, Bux fails. Retribution for my disappointment? Hardly. I want another coach because there is no way that what we have now is the way forward.

[ANNODAM]

I love reading peoples excuses.

Some people just can't face the truth even when it's staring right back at them!


Carry on...